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adams_babymomma |
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Tuesday, January 8, 2008 at 6:39 PM
Edited Tuesday, January 8, 2008 at 6:40 PM on this site... I'm gonna reply but don't know what to say.
—adams_babymomma |
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Dark Laith |
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Tuesday, January 8, 2008 at 7:06 PM I'm gonna reply but don't know what to say. —adams_babymomma suggestion: "NUEK THE ARABZ" —Dark Laith |
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ZT Spice |
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Tuesday, January 8, 2008 at 11:11 PM Only viable response is your own full frontal nudity. —ZT Spice |
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derekho |
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Tuesday, January 8, 2008 at 11:14 PM It's obvious that they have never been to southern california. Most of those responses were logically bad, just a bunch of ad hominum fallacies about how you can't trust them and that they are bad people. I'd like them to look at a kurdish kid square in the eyes who has taken no lands from anyone and tell him that he is a thief. The only way to remove large groups of people from a region is genocide. Additionally, how do those same people feel about their displacement of the Byzantines in the 10th and 11th century. Most of the middle east, according to their very same arguments, (except for the deserts of the arabian peninsula) was 'stolen' from the byzantines, who stole it from the egyptians, syrians, jews, sumerians, persians, sasanids, et. al. To try and say 'we stole this land before you stole it' is both petty and illogical. We are much too far along in the history of the world to think that there will ever be a place where the land 'belongs' to only one group of people. Analogy. Suppose you are evicted from your home. Perhaps you lived there a long time, but that does not mean that you have any natural right to that property. People cannot 'own' land in the same sense that we can own a car or an iPod, just as 'owning' the air or soil or water is difficult. Question. If my country owns the land in which a river begins, say the Nile for instance. If my country owns the starting place of the Nile and the water in the Nile comes from my land, would I be within my rights to charge people in Egypt for the use of that water? Once property has passed out of my control, do I have a right to ownership? Do any of those people who claim the Kurds stole 'their land' remember this 'theft' taking place? Did it happen in their lifetime? Their parent's lifetime? Their grandparent's lifetime? Before this time much of the middle east was not distinctly separated into different countries because it was part of a larger empire. Regardless, these claims about 'digging in the soil and seeing the land is not theirs' are totally bogus. Quote. "The present-day home of the Kurds, the high mountain region south and south-east of Lake Van between Persia and Mesopotamia, was in the possession of Kurds before the time of the ancient Greek historian Xenophon, and was known as the country of the Carduchi, Cardyene or Cordyene. Xenophon referred to the Kurds in the Anabasis as "Kardukhi...a fierce and protective mountain-dwelling people" who attacked Greek armies in 400 BCE." 
Note the location of Corduene between modern day Turkey and Iraq. Quote "Also the Kurdish Kingdom of Corduene became a province of the Roman Empire in 66 BC when Lucullus helped the Cordueni to throw off the yoke of Tigranes who had earlier killed their king Zarbienus." Historically people have been displaced. The majority group in a region generally decides the fate of the minority group. This can be done in a moral or immoral way. Kurds can be shown to have at lease 2000 years of historic claim to this area of the world. Perhaps other peoples can claim the same or greater claim. Regardless, 2000 years is a substantial period of time. Analogy. Great britain was conquered around the same time as Corduene was, and was also conquered by the Romans. Native peoples of various parts of Britainia were absorbed into Roman culture (East Anglia and the rest), slaughtered (Iceni, scots, welsh), or ignored (Cornwall). Later on, much of the areas that were Romanized were conquered by Jutes, Saxons, and Angles. Even later these same areas were conquered by Vikings. Finally Normans conquered all of England. Perhaps some Welsh people today could say, "Hey! Our Gaelic speaking ancestors had their land ruthlessly stolen from them by the Romans! We claim our right to all of England which was once ours, and as proof look at the ancient stone circles like stonehenge. Surely we have the greatest right to this land. Everyone else can get out." Perhaps some Italians could come in and say, "This land became our ancestors by right of conquest, we demand a piece! Look at all the ancient cities they built, this is surely proof." The Germans could come in and say, "The Jutes and Saxons and Angles settled this land and so we have a right to it! Look at how influenced your culture and language is by ours!" Etc. Etc. Until the end of time. Instead, people accept that land has changed hands in the past, and that by now it is impossible to go get them all back to their 'rightful' owners. Analogy. If you are playing monopoly and forget to collect rent from someone who lands on your property, you cannot go back and ask them for it at the end of the game. That would be stupid. In these areas of the Middle East, there have been far more transitions of power over various areas than even England's invasion rich history. By now it is far to late to collect the rent from long ago. Rather it would be stupid, and would cause quite a bit of suffering for those involved. People deserve a government that will not ignore their problems. This is generally accepted as true coming from a western standpoint. The Kurdish people, be they loved or hated, rightful owners of the land or not, good people or bad, are living their lives in these areas, just as the non-kurds are. They will not give up all they have ever known because of something that happened 2000 years ago, just as none of us would. That would be stupid. The relations between these peoples are purely political, there is no way to appeal to right or wrong, history, conquest, elapsed time. They need to learn how to get along, or they need to learn how to kill every last one of the opposing group. Until one of these two things happens there will not be peace in the northern Middle East. End. —derekho |
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derekho |
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Tuesday, January 8, 2008 at 11:15 PM Spelling, grammar, punctuation errors. Deal with it. —derekho |
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ZT Spice |
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Tuesday, January 8, 2008 at 11:19 PM anobody - physics - wikipedia links + freaky teenage sex + crooked teeth - seven years or so = derekho —ZT Spice |
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derekho |
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Tuesday, January 8, 2008 at 11:21 PM My teeth are perfect. —derekho |
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anobody |
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Wednesday, January 9, 2008 at 8:15 AM And I don't do that annoying thing where I tell you - "this is an analogy" or "this is a question" Did it happen in their lifetime? Their parent's lifetime? Their grandparent's lifetime? This always bothers me about thing like slavery reparations. None of the people directly involved on either side are alive. No body who knew them personally or even knows someone who knew them personally is still alive. Exchanging money between people now who have no interest or culpability in what happened way back then does nothing to make up for the atrocities that were committed by one group's ancestors against another's, and even if those things were carried genetically, there are plenty of people who would land on either side because of their skin color who are like me in that none of their ancestors were even here at the time - and that's relatively recent history in comparison.
—anobody |
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John Lennon |
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Wednesday, January 9, 2008 at 9:07 AM And if you're biracial, shouldn't you only get half the repayment? —John Lennon |
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derekho |
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Wednesday, January 9, 2008 at 1:52 PM I don't mind, abm. Do what you like. Sorry you dont like my format, ano. It's mostly for myself to remember to finish what I start talking about. Otherwise my arguments don't go anywhere. Also, there shouldn't be any repayments. Just like ano said, it is stupid to give people money for things that happened that long ago. If I were to sue Germany because my great-grandfather died in world war one, I would not succeed. Oh, but maybe all of the Middle eastern countries should just sue the west for drawing all the political boundaries without paying attention to how they were alienating various groups of people. That would be great. —derekho |
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ZT Spice |
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Wednesday, January 9, 2008 at 5:28 PM DEREK, ANOBODY IS YOUR MASCOT. —ZT Spice |
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anobody |
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Wednesday, January 9, 2008 at 5:39 PM Sorry you dont like my format, ano. It's mostly for myself to remember to finish what I start talking about. Otherwise my arguments don't go anywhere. Honestly - I'm just messing with you (nothing wrong with it).
—anobody |
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adams_babymomma |
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Wednesday, January 9, 2008 at 6:47 PM derek how many words can you type per minute?
All your teacher must love you to death.
—adams_babymomma |
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lexieho |
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Wednesday, January 9, 2008 at 6:47 PM he also s's d's for free. i've seen it. —lexieho |
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ZT Spice |
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Wednesday, January 9, 2008 at 6:49 PM I ONLY SUCK DICK IN SELF-DEFENSE AND AT THE LIBRARY. —ZT Spice |
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derekho |
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Wednesday, January 9, 2008 at 6:56 PM I'm not the best typer. My brother and mom can type faster than anyone I have ever seen. It's crazy. he also s's d's for free. i've seen it. Oh you would, wouldn't you. —derekho |
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