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anobody |
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Tuesday, August 14, 2007 at 10:15 PM If so - what the eff is wrong with you people? —anobody |
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hash-is-gay |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 12:45 AM being a vegan is okay, it's just not very effective. you just making your life a little more difficult for no real gain. —hash-is-gay |
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pookie |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 1:41 AM It's interesting to me that the vegans I know all eat vegan burgers and hot dogs. Have you ever read the list of ungodly ingredients in those things? If vegans are trying to live healthy or avoid "toxins" that are in meats, then why are they consuming fake meats that contain space-age polymers? —pookie |
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plurry |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 2:11 AM my experience is that about half of vegans have eating disorders and are trying to get out of putting on weight and/or have other mental issues.
i'm not being a smart ass. they want to come off as all informed and smart, but it's bullshit. they don't live any longer than anyone else. they're just self righteous and horribly annoying to the other 99% of the world. i'm into not hurting animals either, but fuck it. not eating meat goes against our genetics. if we weren't supposed to eat meat, we'd have teeth like cows.
now that i've gone back to eating it, i actually feel a bit better overall. this comes from someone who was a veggie for a decade mostly just because i wanted to be an annoying pain in the ass. i understand that now. if i could have had therapy in my 20's, they would have sucked less, and i'd be farther along in life. also, anyone try that new sirloin burger from jack off the box?
fucking deeeelish!!!
—plurry |
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anobody |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 6:28 AM being a vegan is okay, it's just not very effective. you just making your life a little more difficult for no real gain. Apparently you haven't eaten at a vegan / raw restaurant. If vegans are trying to live healthy or avoid "toxins" that are in meats, then why are they consuming fake meats that contain space-age polymers? Ah. I just learned this recently, but there are some vegans who will eat Morningstar (tofu processed into meat that looks erie but somehow tastes reasonable) and then there are others... who think the Morningstar (or even just tofu) is too 'processed' so they have to eat raw shit. my experience is that about half of vegans have eating disorders and are trying to get out of putting on weight and/or have other mental issues.
i'm not being a smart ass. they want to come off as all informed and smart, but it's bullshit. they don't live any longer than anyone else. they're just self righteous and horribly annoying to the other 99% of the world. That is consistent with my somewhat limited experience. this comes from someone who was a veggie for a decade mostly just because i wanted to be an annoying pain in the ass. i understand that now. Think (not you Plurry, but everyone else) about dating or being married to someone like that. Even if they tolerate "meat eaters", every time you want to go out to dinner, or (worse) over to a friend's house, their veganism has to factor in. And vegan means (to serious people at least) no animal products what so ever. Now... that doesn't sound so bad, but when you peal back the surface, that means that most beer and wine are out (who knew meat goes into them?), so is most processed sugar (it's common to use ground up bones in the refinement process), and a ton of other things you would never suspect. It's true that Americans eat too much saturated fat and not enough vegetables, but this is just taking it way too far. i'm into not hurting animals Neither am I. Some people my ex-wife will go so far as to say something like "I love animals, but if I could do it, I'd be a vegetarian"... well, I wouldn't. Couldn't shop, cook, or eat a meal without thinking about it. Hell - couldn't have french fries or tortilla chips without asking about them because they might have been cooked in lard (or, as a Hindu discovered a few years back, they might have ground cow seasoning... by the way - what business does a Hindu have going into McDonalds in the first place?). If I could, I would only eat animals that were treated humanely. if i could have had therapy in my 20's, they would have sucked less, and i'd be farther along in life. You need to tell that to that chick in the other forum who wants to take "herbs". anyone try that new sirloin burger from jack off the box? Not yet... but I need to detox from my vegan dinner last night, so maybe I'll hit them on the way in this morning. —anobody |
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bguirk |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 7:30 AM I don't think I could ever go completely vegan, but I have been vegetarian before. I could probably give up meat again and have thought about it, but I lift weights and I need some easy protein preferably from an animal. Eggs and milk cut it and no one has to be killed for me to get those (although veal is a byproduct of the milk generation process). Bean/nut/plant protein would be hard to make a satisfying diet out of, but I suppose if you have Tobey Maguire/Leo Dicapprio money and a personal chef it could be done in a way where you wouldn't feel entirely deprived, but it's definitely a diet for the well to do. Morningstar products rock (they didn't used to) but no vegan should be eating them due to the egg whites they use in a lot of their shit. If they could work a smoky taste in there I could probably give up the bacon I allow myself on Saturday mornings.
—bguirk |
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000 |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 7:36 AM i think i would starve to death if i had to eat vegan style —000 |
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jezebel |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 8:17 AM
Edited Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 8:17 AM i'm into not hurting animals either, but fuck it. not eating meat goes against our genetics. if we weren't supposed to eat meat, we'd have teeth like cows. This is not a good argument, plurry. I'm disappointed in you.
Even if they tolerate "meat eaters", every time you want to go out to dinner, or (worse) over to a friend's house, their veganism has to factor in.
And this is a problem for you because...?
Bean/nut/plant protein would be hard to make a satisfying diet out of
No way, black beans and rice are a complete protein, and they make you full for like hours.
it's definitely a diet for the well to do
No way again, meat costs like ten times as much as stuff that isn't meat, weight-for-weight anyway. Plus you waste less. —jezebel |
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bguirk |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 8:31 AM No way again, meat costs like ten times as much as stuff that isn't meat, It's not the meat vs. no meat that's the cost of being vegan--I look at it as time + limited market for prepared food. Pound for pound a bag of rice is cheaper than just about anything but so what. If you still want to eat bread or similar products finding a loaf made w/o eggs is going to cost you a pretty penny. I tried/am trying not to buy prepped food made with corn syrup and it inflates my grocery bill--a loaf made w/o egg or milk runs pretty high scratching $5 when you can get a loaf of grocery store basic for .89. Soy products aren't cheap--soy milk runs you 160% the cost of regular milk by the gallon. If you have the time, which for those of us who are working or otherwise busy is a very significant cost, you can create a satisfying diet out of it. Don't pretend that it doesn't take considerable education, preparation, and commitment. I semi-admire the non-crazy minority of vegans who succeed, but our culture makes doing so very costly both in terms of reputation, time, and money. —bguirk |
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ZT Spice |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 12:29 PM If so - what the eff is wrong with you people? —anobody Not everyone on the forum lets Penn Jillette think for them. —ZT Spice |
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plurry |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 4:22 PM saying we weren't given the teeth of omnivores isn't a good point? i worked at a grocery store for seven years, morningstar farms and boca cost much more than meat products. example: tyson 12oz frozen chicken tenders - $2.99
morningstar farms 10oz frozen chick nuggets - $3.69 look, i'm not saying to live on meat, but having it once a day is probably a good thing.
plus, what pookie said. —plurry |
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anobody |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 4:30 PM
Edited Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 4:32 PM saying we weren't given the teeth of omnivores isn't a good point? Bringing facts that contradict her position into the argument is bad. it's definitely a diet for the well to do. I'm quite confident I couldn't do it even then. Morningstar products rock (they didn't used to) but no vegan should be eating them due to the egg whites they use in a lot of their shit. That's funny - I didn't know that :D Somehow doesn't surprise me as the 'vegan' who introduced me to that was a former Scientologist. And this is a problem for you because...? Well... if I was to hypothetically date a vegan, it'd be a colossal pain in the ass to go anywhere. No way, black beans and rice are a complete protein, and they make you full for like hours. Satisfying can mean in terms of taste - no just filling you up. Anyway - who knew that Jezebel was a veggie / vegan? If you still want to eat bread or similar products finding a loaf made w/o eggs is going to cost you a pretty penny I'm guessing it's gonna have a funky texture and taste like ass too. If you have the time, which for those of us who are working or otherwise busy is a very significant cost, you can create a satisfying diet out of it. I don't buy that (certainly not for myself). The best veganish food I've had is that Morningstar (which is apparently not even vegan). There was also some sort of gluten ball that I could imagine eating once every few weeks without vomiting. Beyond that, the best of it seems pretty crappy to me. our culture makes doing so very costly both in terms of reputation, time, and money. In terms of reputation - if you're going to make a lifestyle choice that forces everyone who wants to do something with you or to invite you over to make special and extreme concessions specifically for you, I think it's fair that your reputation be a bit tarnished by it. I hear a lot of this "our culture" or "western culture" crap, but as far as I know, most veggie cultures are either that way because of religion (like Buddhism) or necessity (veggies are cheaper to grow and buy than meat - even if factory farming has tilted the balance a bit here). To me, that kinda puts a hole in the whole "western culture" argument (but then, I'm funny like that). Not everyone on the forum lets Penn Jillette think for them. Yes because that's exactly what I do and he actually had something to do with me posting this thread. —anobody |
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jezebel |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 4:40 PM
Edited Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 4:47 PM "The short canines in humans are a functional consequence of the enlarged cranium and associated reduction of the size of the jaws. In primates, canines function as both defense weapons and visual threat devices. Interestingly, the primates with the largest canines (gorillas and gelada baboons) both have basically vegetarian diets. In archeological sites, broken human molars are most often confused with broken premolars and molars of pigs, a classic omnivore. On the other hand, some herbivores have well-developed incisors that are often mistaken for those of human teeth when found in archeological excavations." I don't know if it's the most convincing argument, coming from The Vegetarian Resource Group and all, but still... i worked at a grocery store for seven years, morningstar farms and boca cost much more than meat products You're comparing upscale/health food to mass-factory-produced, byproduct-ridden, gross food. Compare Morningstar/Boca/Quorn/whatever to a comparable meat product (one marketed to the same consumer), then we'll talk prices. it'd be a colossal pain in the ass to go anywhere. It would be a colossal pain in the ass to go anywhere with you. Oh snap. (I'm just kidding anyway, you seem like a nice enough fellow, but you are kind of a pain in the ass, what with the arguing and stuff.) I'm guessing it's gonna have a funky texture and taste like ass too. You've obviously never eaten it. The problem with people like you is that you're trying to compare things (veggie burgers with hamburgers, etc.) and they never taste the same, they're different - but because they're different you automatically assume they're "bad." That makes me cranky. if you're going to make a lifestyle choice that forces everyone who wants to do something with you or to invite you over to make special and extreme concessions specifically for you, I think it's fair that your reputation be a bit tarnished by it. I don't know what vegetarians you know, but they must be the angry/militant ones. I don't know a single vegetarian who "forces everyone who wants to do something with" them to "make special and extreme concessions." Hello, side dishes - it's not like you eat nothing but meat, right? Everybody stop this. anobody, plurry, I know you people are smarter than this. Edit: Bringing facts that contradict her position into the argument is bad. anobody, I don't know if I like you anymore. I take back the part about you seeming like a nice fellow. So there. —jezebel |
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bguirk |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 4:43 PM I hear a lot of this "our culture" or "western culture" crap, I wasn't saying this is good or bad, it just is. You did a nice job of describing the reputational costs by the way. —bguirk |
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Beat It! |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 4:58 PM who knew that Jezebel was a veggie / vegan? Not I, but it seems totally obvious now though, given her personality. —Beat It! |
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jezebel |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 5:06 PM
Edited Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 5:06 PM I don't get it. —jezebel |
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jezebel |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 5:11 PM I'm pretty sure I'm offended. Weren't we going to Scrabble-duel sometime, or was that somebody else? I get all you internet people confused. —jezebel |
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anobody |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 5:14 PM It would be a colossal pain in the ass to go anywhere with you. Rancid certainly seemed to think so. you are kind of a pain in the ass, what with the arguing and stuff Especially when I'm arguing against something you're into, eh? You've obviously never eaten it. As a matter of fact, I have (actually - that's what spurred this thread if you hadn't caught that). Just last night, I ate at a vegan / raw place called "The Mandala Tea Room. 40-bucks for two people and that consisted of a 'curry' that was mostly shredded carrots and radish covered in a yellow sauce that smelled like warm piss with partially fermented soybean patties pretending to be meat, 'burritos' wrapped in lettuce with a bit of and some kind of fake product that pretended to be chocolate. The problem with people like you is that you're trying to compare things (veggie burgers with hamburgers, etc.) and they never taste the same, they're different - but because they're different you automatically assume they're "bad." It's not just that they're different - it's that my impulse on eating them is to vomit. They have a weird texture, and their flavor is either non-existent or horrifically bizarre to my palette. The problem with people like you is that you're into some sort of nutty 'food', most of which is an imitation of meat eater food, but when someone says they don't like it, in your mind, it's gotta be that they're expecting something shaped like a hamburger to taste like a hamburger (which - if it was the case, would obviously be insane). Believe me, I can judge a veggie patty on its own merit. I have, and they're just not that good. It's not because they don't measure up to a hamburger, or because they're different than a hamburger, it's because I simply don't like them. As I said above, about the best veggie stuff I've had is that Morningstar space-aged polymer that looks freaky but almost tastes and feels like meat. But then - if meat is so bad, why go to all the trouble of making veggie hot dogs and hamburgers and ground beef in the first place? That makes me cranky You probably just need a nice, juicy, rare steak. I've obviously struck a nerve here Jezz. If you didn't feel like you have something to defend, I don't think you'd care so much. I don't know what vegetarians you know, but they must be the angry/militant ones. I don't know a single vegetarian who "forces everyone who wants to do something with" them to "make special and extreme concessions." Hello, side dishes - it's not like you eat nothing but meat, right? The ones I know are actually quite civil and reasonable. Picture this though. My friend is having a barbecue at his house, and invites me over. Now, I'm bringing my veggie girlfriend / wife, and so he's gotta make special food for her, or she can't eat a main course. We're going out with friends for dinner.... but she's a veggie/vegan. Well then... she's either stuck with a salad or something inadequately small (man can not live on side-dishes alone), or everyone else has to change their plans and go to a restaurant that will have something that she can eat something more substantial. Those are special and extreme concessions. I don't know if I like you anymore Meh... join the club. I'm sure Liz will send you a pamphlet. I wasn't saying this is good or bad, it just is. I didn't think you were, but I've got extra energy stored up from getting an ass full of that yesterday. You did a nice job of describing the reputational costs by the way. Thank you (though Jezz doesn't seem to agree). —anobody |
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jezebel |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 5:30 PM
Edited Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 5:34 PM Especially when I'm arguing against something you're into, eh? No, especially all the time, but usually I'm not mad at you.
The problem with people like you is that you're into some sort of nutty 'food', most of which is an imitation of meat eater food,
Actually, I don't eat substitute meat at all, mostly because of what pookie said. I mean, not because she said them, because those are the reasons...wait. What I mean is, I'm not into over-processed foods, at least not on a regular basis. So. I'd choose a grilled portabello over a veggie burger any day.
but when someone says they don't like it, in your mind, it's gotta be that they're expecting something shaped like a hamburger to taste like a hamburger (which - if it was the case, would obviously be insane).
It happens more often than you'd think, it's not like I'm just making this shit up..
You probably just need a nice, juicy, rare steak.
Gosh, that's a good one. I've never heard it before.
Those are special and extreme concessions.
Your hypothetical girlfriend is a lazy, picky pain in the ass. When I'm invited to a barbecue or other event, I make/bring my own food. Plus, most restaurants have vegetarian options, and the nicer ones will make you pasta with olive oil and vegetables, or whatever else they have on hand, especially if you flirt really well with the waiter. It's kind of weird that you're so vehement about someone else's decision - it's not like anyone's forcing it on you, or judging you, or taking your meat away, or anything of the sort. So you don't like vegan food...vegans don't like meat. Just, you know, chill out, brotha. —jezebel |
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pookie |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 5:35 PM I tried going vegetarian and even vegan before to see if it would make me feel better, but it made no difference in how I felt. I love rice and beans, nuts, fruits and vegetables, so that was not a problem. But hey, Ruth's Chris, Shula's, and Morton's, and Hyde Park ain't so bad either. —pookie |
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bguirk |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 6:03 PM Weren't we going to Scrabble-duel sometime, or was that somebody else? That was me and it was boggle. Your hypothetical girlfriend is a lazy, picky pain in the ass. When I'm invited to a barbecue or other event, I make/bring my own food. Agreed and this is what I used to do--that or I ate before. If it's a more formal dinner it's more of a pain in the ass, but on the West Coast it's sort of expected--I have a feeling it would be harder to be vegetarian in Arkansas than Oregon. Please post your favorite vegan recipe and anobody has to eat it. —bguirk |
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plurry |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 6:06 PM beat it! was in on the scrabble/boggle discussion. —plurry |
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jezebel |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 6:10 PM Oh yeah, Boggle. I'm still going to wipe you on the floor. Wipe the floor with you. I forget how it goes, but I'm going to kick your ass anyway. I'll look through my favorite recipes. I'm thinking falafel, everyone loves falafel. Hummus? Spanikopita? —jezebel |
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doingdoingdoing |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 6:14 PM Humans have teeth a lot more like cows than like meat eating animals. A better argument for why we aren't meant to eat like a cow would be that they have four stomachs to digest all that plant cellulose. —doingdoingdoing |
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plurry |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 6:17 PM umm, teeth like horses then? —plurry |
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anobody |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 6:17 PM
Edited Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 6:20 PM It happens more often than you'd think, it's not like I'm just making this shit up.. I don't think you are (but I also think that shit is mostly just a bogus excuse). Gosh, that's a good one. I've never heard it before. I aims to pleaze. When I'm invited to a barbecue or other event, I make/bring my own food. Yes - this is not annoying or insulting at all. Plus, most restaurants have vegetarian options I'll make a point of checking out the menus in the future, but (especially in the case of a vegan), I find it difficult to imagine that there's going to be much beyond a veggie plate that you could eat. ... which I guess if fine if you're anorexic. and the nicer ones will make you pasta with olive oil and vegetables, or whatever else they have on hand, especially if you flirt really well with the waiter. This is good. Not just a special order, but something that's not even on the bloody menu. It's kind of weird that you're so vehement about someone else's decision - it's not like anyone's forcing it on you, or judging you, or taking your meat away, or anything of the sort. I'm not so vehement as you think, but I am rather annoyed by it (to the extent that about a second of thought made me realize that it's a deal-breaker). Please post your favorite vegan recipe and anobody has to eat it. Think I'll pass there (unless it's the pureed split peas they have at The Blue Nile; in that case... yum!). *edit* everyone loves falafel. eh... not so much. Hummus? Sure (but it's an appetizer - not a meal). Spanakopita? Nope (doesn't it have cheese anyway? not exactly vegan).
—anobody |
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jezebel |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 6:31 PM
Edited Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 6:32 PM See, I'm not sure if I'm supposed to keep going with this and be the girl who annoys herself, or if I should stop now and be the girl who's disappointed in herself. You're like a lose-lose situation to me. Sigh. Yes - this is not annoying or insulting at all. More annoying or insulting than:
a.) Requesting something else from the host that, apparently, won't be there?
or
b.) Not eating anything, at a primarily food-based function and looking rude and/or picky? Plus, if you bring your own dish, you can share, and then you look like you're contributing. This is why I think you're just arguing to be arguing. Stop it, because it's rude, and people don't like it.
Not just a special order, but something that's not even on the bloody menu.
Like I said: "what they have on hand." It's not like I'm making them go to Kansas to pick special corn for me. You say, "Can the chef make anything without eggs/cheese/meat products/whatever you don't want?" Like people with food allergies/diabetes/other conditions do on a daily basis?
My spanikopita is cheese-free. But you can put feta in if you want, or something.
I'm probably done with this thread, because now you're just being contrary.
—jezebel |
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plurry |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 6:39 PM i had a lengthy come back prepared about an hour ago, but deleted it. —plurry |
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jezebel |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 6:41 PM There's nobody on Team Jezebel? —jezebel |
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mandeemoo22 |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 6:46 PM i haven't read any of this, but i'll be on team jezebel. —mandeemoo22 |
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plurry |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 6:48 PM i am, but not on this topic. —plurry |
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doingdoingdoing |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 6:50 PM I agree with you, but who cares right? People can be too picky about food whether they eat meat or not. Vegans & vegetarians aren't necessarily any worse. —doingdoingdoing |
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plurry |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 6:52 PM 
what's up with this? —plurry |
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bguirk |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 6:54 PM I'll be on Team jezebel (I want a jersey)--I have too many nutty vegan friends that I love to leave a virtual one hanging as long as I'm allowed my personal reservations. —bguirk |
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jezebel |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 6:57 PM Personal reservations make me happy. JERSEYS! Those make me happy too. —jezebel |
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anobody |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 6:59 PM See, I'm not sure if I'm supposed to keep going with this and be the girl who annoys herself, or if I should stop now and be the girl who's disappointed in herself. You're like a lose-lose situation to me. Ditto. More annoying or insulting than:
a.) Requesting something else from the host that, apparently, won't be there?
or
b.) Not eating anything, at a primarily food-based function and looking rude and/or picky? No - but less than c.) being flexible enough to eat whatever they're going to serve you When I go over to my Indian friend's house, I don't ask him to make me some hot dogs - I eat what his wife makes (and generally like it). I don't bring some hamburger over and ask to funk up their place and eff with them by cooking it or asking them to cook it. Plus, if you bring your own dish, you can share, and then you look like you're contributing. That's great... if it's pot-luck. This is why I think you're just arguing to be arguing. Stop it, because it's rude, and people don't like it. You can think what you will, but that doesn't make it so. Like I said: "what they have on hand." It's not like I'm making them go to Kansas to pick special corn for me. You say, "Can the chef make anything without eggs/cheese/meat products/whatever you don't want?" Like people with food allergies/diabetes/other conditions do on a daily basis? Again - pain in the ass... and unlike someone with real allergies or severe diabetes, this is volitional (it's not like you have a medical condition that forces you to order something special that's not on the menu; you chose not to go with the flow - I'm not saying that's intrinsically wrong, but when you do that there are consequences, and pretending there aren't or that they don't matter doesn't diminish them). My spanikopita is cheese-free. Then it's not really spanikopita (not that I'd like it if it were). I'm probably done with this thread No skin off my back. because now you're just being contrary. No - you just think I'm being contrary. I'm telling you what I think and what my opinion is. That's a nice and convenient way of dismissing my opinion though. Always appreciate it. —anobody |
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plurry |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 6:59 PM that chick is on Dx3's profile. if that's her... omg —plurry |
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jezebel |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 7:02 PM If I were dismissing your opinion, I wouldn't have engaged this long. It's obviously going nowhere. —jezebel |
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bguirk |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 7:03 PM
Edited Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 7:07 PM just a thought--girls should wear interesting stockings more. you chose not to go with the flow - I'm not saying that's intrinsically wrong, but when you do that there are consequences, and pretending there aren't or that they don't matter doesn't diminish them). While I sort of said this in an earlier post I don't think there's anything wrong with this choice. We can talk about what a pain in the ass vegans are (and some of them really are, but there's some awesome ones too), but we could also talk about how an American meat eating diet contributes greatly to global warming and geysers of pig shit and how in the face of this knowledge perpetuating the two conditions is also a choice. Now pass the bacon (and go read The Omnivore's Dilemma or listen to his Fresh Air episode). —bguirk |
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Dusty TheHick |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 7:04 PM just a thought--girls should wearbe interesting stockings more. —bguirk fxd —Dusty TheHick |
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ZT Spice |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 7:05 PM i haven't read any of this, but i'll be on team jezebel. —mandeemoo22 Me too. Anobody - sucking Penn Jillette's cock doesn't make you a carnivore, or even a better magician, it just makes you YET ANOTHER COCK SUCKER. —ZT Spice |
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anobody |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 7:06 PM
Edited Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 7:07 PM that chick is on Dx3's profile. if that's her... omg Right up your alley, eh? If I were dismissing your opinion, I wouldn't have engaged this long. It's obviously going nowhere. And yet you think I'm arguing for the sake of arguing. —anobody |
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jezebel |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 7:07 PM I heart you guys and your Team Jezebel-ness. Let's get jerseys and cute leggings and do cheers. Yes? Please say yes. —jezebel |
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bguirk |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 7:09 PM fxd —Dusty TheHick How DARE you. FWIW I find that girls that wear interesting stockings tend to be interesting, but I can forgive a lot of fucktarded girl shit for the right pair of knee high argyles. —bguirk |
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plurry |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 7:23 PM christ, anobody. smoke a joint, will ya? —plurry |
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anobody |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 7:29 PM That might interfere with the meth. —anobody |
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plurry |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 7:34 PM they actually go together well. the meth fixes the ADD that pot brings with it. —plurry |
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Beat It! |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 7:35 PM beat it! was in on the scrabble/boggle discussion. — plurry Damn right. In fact, I believe I started it (and it was Boggle, not Scrabble), though the initial gauntlet was thrown at mandee. —Beat It! |
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anobody |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 7:36 PM they actually go together well. the meth fixes the ADD that pot brings with it. I'm a unidrugian - only one kind of high at a time. —anobody |
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jezebel |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 7:39 PM Beat It! hates girls. —jezebel |
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anobody |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 7:42 PM Do you have a good lacto-ovo veggie recipe for peanut butter cookies? —anobody |
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jezebel |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 7:44 PM Umm, aren't most peanut butter cookie recipes lacto-ovo? I mean, most people don't put meat in their peanut butter cookies, right? —jezebel |
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anobody |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 7:45 PM They don't? Guess I've been doin' it wrong. Go figure! —anobody |
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jezebel |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 7:47 PM Am I missing something? I feel like you're making fun of me behind my back and I don't get the joke. —jezebel |
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anobody |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 7:48 PM More like making fun of myself (and even then don't feel too bad, it's not a good joke). —anobody |
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Beat It! |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 7:53 PM Am I missing something? I feel like you're making fun of me behind my back and I don't get the joke. — jezebel That's a feeling you're used to though, right? —Beat It! |
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ZT Spice |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 8:12 PM
Edited Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 8:16 PM And yet you think I'm arguing for the sake of arguing. —anobody The more I observe you when you get in to italicized quote point-by-point debate mode, the more I question whether or not you're arguing for the sake of arguing or if it's just more Libertarian fanboyism meets Aspergers syndrome. I mean, I love you anyways. —ZT Spice |
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anobody |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 8:16 PM
Edited Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 8:17 PM I love you too ZT (but you're wrong on all three counts and it's really not just arguing for argument's sake).
—anobody |
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jezebel |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 8:18 PM go read The Omnivore's Dilemma or listen to his Fresh Air episode bguirk, I just fell in heart with you all over again. —jezebel |
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Beat It! |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 8:27 PM you're wrong on all three counts and it's really not just arguing for argument's sake Looks like a duck, quacks like a duck... —Beat It! |
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doingdoingdoing |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 8:36 PM Dusty I agree with you. Unless you were directing that at me, in which case... screw it. I still agree with you. Eghh I feel all weird now. I put that up a while ago when everyone else was doing it. Oh well. —doingdoingdoing |
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plurry |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 8:48 PM Dx3, are you saying that is you? —plurry |
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anobody |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 8:58 PM
Edited Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 8:59 PM "It puts the lotion..." we could also talk about how an American meat eating diet contributes greatly to global warming and geysers of pig shit and how in the face of this knowledge perpetuating the two conditions is also a choice. I'm certainly not about to defend factory farms or the efficiency of growing meat versus veggies and I'll certainly agree that eating meat is also a choice (albeit the default choice, and one that allows me to eat all the little tasty animals and plants). Barring an ecological catastrophe, you're not going to get a significant number of people to stop eating meat, and despite what the vegetarians (and worse vegans) tell us, their food really is kinda weird and crappy (and that's coming from someone who once ate live shrimp, and who loves Japanese, Indian, and Ethiopian food). As far as improving our agriculture and doing a better job on that end, I'm all with you, but you'll have to pry my meat from my cold, dead hands.
—anobody |
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plurry |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 9:02 PM
Edited Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 9:02 PM just like you would have had to from our ancestors. —plurry |
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bguirk |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 9:07 PM Barring an ecological catastrophe, Just read a great book called "Physical." Basically the American default diet of meat & potatoes is not medically sustainable into your 50's (Unless you really don't want to see your 60's) for most people. The meat serving you're supposed to be having is once a day about the size of a deck of cards and that's a compromise recommendation because doctors know how suggesting people go vegetarian 4 days a week would be received. I'm not going to tell other people what to eat, but I will testify that if people started focusing on quality be it with meat or whatever instead of greasy processed calories we'd be better off in a number of ways. —bguirk |
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anobody |
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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 at 9:32 PM Who the hell eats nothing but meat and potatoes? Seems like a straw-man to me. Obviously if we ate better, we'd be better off in a number of ways. Without doing any research, you can just guess that moderation would be healthier. That has nothing to do with whether or not vegetarian. Anyway - just to bring this thread back on topic - it is "vegans" I was referring to specifically. Vegetarians are still a little weird, but I've got no real beef with 'em. Vegans - in particular the ones who won't eat sugar because ground bone might have been used in the refinement process, or beer because there might be animal products in it are severely warped. I don't even think that's a controversial statement, and I honestly believe that if Jezz wasn't so close to the issue and so defensive, she might actually agree. —anobody |
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bguirk |
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Thursday, August 16, 2007 at 7:34 AM Who the hell eats nothing but meat and potatoes? Seems like a straw-man to me. It was meant as a euphemism or short hand although here in the midwest you'd be surprised. Vegans - in particular the ones who won't eat sugar because ground bone might have been used in the refinement process, or beer because there might be animal products in it are severely warped. The vegan argument against milk seems a least a little valid to which I answer "yeah, but still." They'll never get me off of eggs or honey though. One of my best friends is a brewer for a large brewery--the only living or once living thing used in the brewing process is yeast--although at what level are you going to draw the line there? Whether they like it or not they're chowing down on microorganisms every day. Follow that logic to it's conclusion and you'll stop taking antibiotics or brushing your teeth. —bguirk |
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jezebel |
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Thursday, August 16, 2007 at 7:55 AM Vegans - in particular the ones who won't eat sugar because ground bone might have been used in the refinement process, or beer because there might be animal products in it are severely warped. Ad hominem. They think you're severely warped for using animals. So.
I honestly believe that if Jezz wasn't so close to the issue and so defensive, she might actually agree
No, you're being wrong. Plus the way you even brought up the topic was designed, even if unintentionally (although I really really really really really really doubt it), to make people defensive, yes? It's not like you came up with a lot of good arguments not to be vegan (other than convenience, which isn't exactly the highest moral ground), you just called them all crazy from the get-go, which actually ends up making you look defensive anyway. Don't be that guy. —jezebel |
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John Lennon |
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Thursday, August 16, 2007 at 9:18 AM Jezebel, are you vegan or just defending the vegan lifestyle/diet choice? —John Lennon |
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Dark Laith |
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Thursday, August 16, 2007 at 10:31 AM and that's coming from someone who once ate live shrimp —anobody Elaborate? —Dark Laith |
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chix0r |
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Thursday, August 16, 2007 at 1:46 PM >>I put that up a while ago when everyone else was doing it. When did we start doing pics in profiles, 2004? Fail. —chix0r |
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anobody |
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Thursday, August 16, 2007 at 4:59 PM Jezebel, are you vegan or just defending the vegan lifestyle/diet choice? Vegetarian, I'd say (which is funny because I don't really have any problem with them). They'll never get me off of eggs or honey though They don't even eat honey? Jesus. the only living or once living thing used in the brewing process is yeast I thought the same, but this turns out not to be true. Beer and wine often have a small amount of added gelatin (which comes from bones), isinglass (which comes from swim bladders of fish), casein (from milk) or albumin (from eggs or blood). Ad hominem. They think you're severely warped for using animals. So. Not really ad hom at all. They're doing something that goes way beyond the realm of "normal" and forcing themselves into absurd contortions to avoid certain things because there *might* be a negligible amount of animal matter in them. The irony is that when they're eating their veggies, they're getting plenty of animal matter anyway (just in terms of the insects that they don't even realize are there). the way you even brought up the topic was designed, even if unintentionally (although I really really really really really really doubt it), to make people defensive, yes? No - it was to mock them (a subtile distinction to be sure). It's not like you came up with a lot of good arguments not to be vegan Do I really need a lot? They want to go way outside the norm to eat crappy food and (in the process) b a pain in the ass. (other than convenience, which isn't exactly the highest moral ground), Cost:benefit. You're a vegetarian (I assume) which means that you're eliminating almost all animal products from what you're eating, but you're not freaking out that maybe there might be one hundredth of one percent of a chance that an animal by-product might have been used in the production of something. You're also (again, I assume) not into "raw" (eating "live" food with "active enzymes"... that are going to be destroyed in your stomach and intestines anyway). These are nutty - pure and simple. They have almost no measurable benefit and they require radical effort (and also make someone come off as a pain in the ass). As a vegetarian, you're saying - I can spend a dollar and go 98% of the way toward eliminating my use of animal products. As a vegan, they're saying - I can spend ninety-nine more dollars and go 99% of the way toward eliminating my use of animal products. A huge amount of extra cost for a trifle amount of benefit is just silly. you just called them all crazy from the get-go. As I said a moment ago - they are crazy (or, at least, seriously warped). We're talking about people who basically have an eating disorder and then go through novelty extremes to satisfy their distorted criteria of what is moral and healthy. —anobody |
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anobody |
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Thursday, August 16, 2007 at 5:05 PM Elaborate? Well... we were at the end of the fiscal year and had more money left over (and if we didn't spend it, we'd get less for the next grant funding cycle), so my boss took me to Tokyo over spring break. While we were there, we went to a nice sushi restaurant (private room; very expensive; mostly awesome food). The food was great except the second to last thing they brought out was seared salmon (which tasted like seared bacon and made me a bit nauseous), and the very last thing - little clear slightly alive shrimp on top of nigiri. I figured it'd be rude not to try it and thought "what the hell". Didn't have much of a taste to it, but the texture was weird. I think it was actually the idea of it that was the worst (and the seared salmon I just ate didn't help). —anobody |
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bguirk |
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Thursday, August 16, 2007 at 8:25 PM Beer and wine often have a small amount of added gelatin (which comes from bones), isinglass (which comes from swim bladders of fish), casein (from milk) or albumin (from eggs or blood). Trust me. From my friend the brewer's mouth to my ears and now to your eyes--none of the above is present in microbrews, craft ales, whatever. It is also not in most of your imports. Bud is made with rice so I'm sure they need to monkey with it more (casein makes sense actually). —bguirk |
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